Fantasy & Beyond

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#1280
This is just a random thought, but you've got me thinking about the gardener/architect dichotomy of writing. I wonder if the two authors fall on either side of that particular divide, and inserted it into the story in some fashion.
That is an interesting theory, though I imagine that the authors just wanted to be able to easily distinguish the two sides as opposing forces, since the agents themselves are virtually copies of one another, which is likely meant to be the point if going this cold war route of showing that they're basically doing the same repetitive roles with no clear end in sight.
#1314
Sorry it took me so long. The mentioned lack of investment in the story kept me from devouring it.

DaveBates wrote: April 3rd, 2024, 14:03 The developing relationship between Blue and Red through their letters is, as I suspected, turning romantic. However, where it was kind of subtle in the earlier chapters, there seems to be a sudden shift where Red has gone totally and utterly mad with love. I found this to be more than a little abrupt, and is making it even harder to buy into what was already going to a hard sell when both of these characters are portrayed as rather drone-like and bred to destroy one another.
Good points, Dave. Only I don't think it was abrupt. I think this is another case of "told not shown". It took hundreds if not thousands of years (whatever time means for them) to get to this point nut it doesn't feel like it because we have only a few short chapters to mark the progress.

Bea, I feel you. The posts here help, though. :)

Your post, Cupi, for example. It was really enlightening and added for me a bit more substance to the story and my theories.

I agree that it's not about winning, it's about keeping the conflict going. Why? No idea. Maybe it's an allegory for chaos/order; tech/nature, Yin/Yang or some other philosophy of duality. They (Garden/Commandant) may not even realize that deep down they do not want to be the dog who caught the car.

Magnus wrote: April 20th, 2024, 08:42 More than anything, this is what makes them drawn to each other; their romance is the first taste of something real, something close to the experiences of the people whose lives they alter or end as a part of their 'everyday' work. Their relationship matters to them because for the first time, there is something personal they can lose. They touch the everyday worries of a normal human for the first time, and it leads the to painful realisations and a deep connection.
All good points, Magnus, especially this one.

What an interesting thought, Alex. I'm too lazy to scour the internet for interviews with them, though.

Magnus wrote: April 21st, 2024, 09:57
cupiscent wrote:Is the Seeker actually a future iteration of one of them (both of them?) stalking Blue's life in order to find her in deep emplacement?
This was something my mind jumped to, as well. And I haven't dismissed the idea that the whole thing is some kind of long con, though in that case I don't think it's run by Red or Blue, but by a third party, perhaps someone neutral to the factions (and the Seeker has something to do with that).

I'm quite excited to listen on now, and I agree that this second part made things a lot more interesting after a slow build-up (though for my part, I enjoyed that).
The seeker is an interesting addition, some sort of wildcard. I don't think she belongs to one of the two factions and I don't think she has ill intent (she doesn't harm Red when she could have, for example). I'm glad there was a direct interaction with Red in this part because always coming later to eat the remnants of the remnants of the letter got a bit boring.

DaveBates wrote: April 21st, 2024, 22:05
The destruction of Atlantis is inevitable in every strand. The scene that plays out in Atlantis is not about saving it from destruction; it's about saving a vital piece of information from the destruction. This is mentioned outright.
So my immediate question to this is what exactly is this information they're "saving", and why do they have to do it over and over again? [...] so what the hell are they even trying to achieve if all they're doing is bouncing around to play live reenactments of events they have no control over?

This is made all the more difficult to imagine when the Garden doesn't even seem to be from earth, as we witness monsters being grown and used as traps, and Blue transforming into alien beasts. When I get tastes of grander scales like this, it becomes hard to imagine how Cesar's massacre is anything more than a speck of dust in the grand scheme of all time and space, let alone something they critically need to participate in so that it turns out exactly the way it did if they'd never even been there.
They don't have to do it over and over again. It's only similar, not the same.
I think it's like this: Both Garden and Agency (and their agents/creatures) exist in/rule over a multiverse with countless worlds and explored space (including other worlds and Aliens). They can move freely and without struggle through time and space and from one universe to the next. The inhabitants don't know they exist. All universes/worlds are similar (they all have Atlantis, Caesar and Nazis) but differ in small parts. All worlds lean either towards Garden or towards Agency. With small changes (giving shelter to a monk, saving a scribe with revolutionary ideas, ...) the course those worlds are on change. Like the industrial revolution coming two centuries early - or not at all. Agency's goal is to make every world as technological as possible while Garden's goal is the opposite. Since new worlds split from other worlds all the time a big change early in a thread influences a lot of worlds later on. It also means that there is an infinite number of worlds ensuring the conflict has enough fodder to keep going.

I'm curious if we'll get answers to all our questions in the last part and if the ending will be satisfying. I'm more motivated than after the first part to finish the book now. :) See you there!
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